there are tons of examples of people who to work out deals in the virginia jihad case. it involved nearly a dozen northern virginians who had gotten training in pakistan. the of assonances for something. it ranged from just a couple of years to maybe 10. the people who went to trial were convicted, some more acquitted. it is not at all uncommon. they can make the case against a more serious one. there is an awful -- an example where they have a high level al qaeda guy who is testified in prevented the witness security program and pled guilty. cracks -- >>'s corporate, do they go into the general population? >> it depends. the often will have a special administrative measure placed on them by the marshal service. they can carry over. i do have people convicted of crimes that will be considered terrorism crime store in the general population at it depends on the individual person. correct. >> this experience was not evident in the federal judiciary. nothing compared to the federal effort structure. this level of expertise makes the dialogue very different products. >> tha